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Scales pt II

Ok im back everybody,my question to you all is?Whats your least scales are?Mines Major scales
Locrian mode and some of the exrotic scales.
Responses
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Re: Scales pt II

11/13/2009 5:52 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

I don't get into exotic scales or compound scales for several reasons.

1) There enough to work on within the diatonic scale itself. Remember each scales has a purpose and they all have some type of sound from happy to sad to dissonant.

2) When diatonic became natural, melodic minor and harmonic minor became the new adventure. Reharmanizing each one of these scales give you many new variations to play over certain chords or what type of textures that you are trying to achieve.

3) Diminished and Wholenote scales take you into the altered realm along with breaking the modes down on melodic minor (please note that it is the Jazz melodic minor for consistancy on the 6th). This brings alot of tension to your playing mechnisms.

4) Explore triad arpeggios. This will open up your playing and get you away from the domino effect.

More later!

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Re: Scales pt II

11/16/2009 8:45 AM

Ken Richardson (9051) wrote:

Arpeggios are cool.

I like doublestops too!


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Re: Scales pt II

11/16/2009 10:24 AM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Yeah, there was more I was going to cover but I didn't. Some other things were Double-stops, triple stops and intervolic playing. To take it to the advanced level, you combine the intervals with you stops. That give you many voicing changes. Let's not also forget, bending the double stops or triple stops.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/16/2009 11:09 AM

Ken Richardson (9051) wrote:

I think that the arpreggios, good use of chord tones and the doublestops are among the best building blocks for solos. As you said the arpreggios will prevent that domino effect.

Intervallic playing is something I am not familiar with, unless I have heard some and did not know that was the term for it. I am pretty much unschooled on theory, except for reading a couple of books and researching online.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/16/2009 12:41 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

I don't consider invervallic playing to be a schooled term but it is what I call it. Allan Holdsworth is one example as you tend to play in wide interval for lines versus scales, arps or patterns. The object is to play using using intervals - m2, M2, m3, M3, P4, A4, etc. to play. This really breaks up monotony. What can be fun with this is to play a scale intervallically by playing for example: 1, 9, 3, 11, 5, 13, 7, 15th for example. It still contains the note names of the Ionian/Major scale but the spacing changes your approach to it all. This will also help you to see the fret board more horizonal than vertical improving your linear playing.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 9:17 AM

Ken Richardson (9051) wrote:

That method would break up the monotony.

I like some basslines like "Taxman" that do that sort of thing, playing with intervals.

Thanks!



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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 10:47 AM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Go for it brother Ken. It will open up your playing. A good story for this is one that I heard the great Larry Carlton did. During a performance he began to cut the 1st string off his guitar and played part of the solo on the remaining 5 strings. One at a time would continue to do this until only the 6th string was left. He finished his solo and song with only the 6th string left. This is great in the sense of playing linearily on your guitar and forces you to think outside the box (pun intended).

I tried done this several times but I was changing strings on my guitar. I cut them all off and replaced them one by one. Each time I replaced a string, I would jam and play something for 15 to 20 minutes testing my ability and making myself look like a fool. After all this is a great challenge and obstacle for improvement.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 12:20 PM

Ken Richardson (9051) wrote:

Thats funny that you mention jamming on a 1 string guitar. I have a guitar that I am fixing up and when I got the nut fixed and the bridge back on, I put on the 4th string and jammed on it for maybe 15 minutes like that. It makes you think a bit, can't rely on patterns so much.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 12:39 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Now that is fun stuff!!! I love it. I may take a guitar and just put one or two strings on to improve my linear play. After all it would save the cost on strings and make playing a greater challenge.



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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 1:24 PM

Chris Bond II (2841) wrote:

Check this out, it is from a long...long out of print book by a cat name Mick Goodrick.

It is without a doubt the most complete guitar text I have ever read.

Excerpt from Section Two

Playing Up and Down on a Single String
(The Science of Unitar)

Three principles of left hand movement:

Groupings; Two, three or four notes based on what the left hand can cover

Hand-carries or shifts: Moving to a higher pitched note with lower numerical finger; moving to a lower pitched note with a higher numerical finger; linking the groupings.

Slides: Using the same finger to play consecutive pitches - No Glissandi

Breakdown of finger possibilities:

A
Four possibilities of one finger at a time
1 1st finger
2 2nd finger
3 3rd finger
4 4th finger
No groupings, no shifts, all slides.

B
Six possibilities of Two Fingers at a Time
1 1 and 2
2 1 and 3
3 1 and 4
4 2 and 3
5 2 and 4
6 3 and 4

C
Four possibilities of three fingers at a time
1 1, 2, 3
2 1, 2, 4
3 1, 3, 4
4 2, 3, 4

D
All four fingers:
Combine all previous possibilities two, three, and four note groupings, shifts and slides.




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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 3:50 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

I remember that book! I wasn't interested at the time but remember that it was quite good. They advertised IIRC in old guitar players and if I remember he was a staff writer in the old guitar players with Tedesco, Roberts, Arnie Berle (loved his column) and others. Nice call CB!!!

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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 1:31 AM

Chris Pinto (24466) wrote:

Yo' Ken,

Good question....

Hell! I don't know the names of most scales, I just play whatever notes fit the tune.... I have a good ear for melody & notes, and, fortunately or unfortunately, I've always taken that for granted.

Should I have learned more theory?
Yeah, probably. :)

Do I regret not learning more theory?
Sometimes.

Would it have helped me be a better player?
YUP! LOL

Does it matter at this stage in my life?
NOPE!

See, my knowledge about music in general is basically a big fat "0"....My knowledge of scales mainly consists of "SOME" Arpeggio patterns, some Pentatonic scales, SOME Major scales, SOME Minor scales, and ONE harmonic minor scale, but, that's about the only theory I know. If you were to ask me any kind of theory-related question....Forget about it! It would be like me trying to answer questions about the "Space-Time Continuum", or "Quantum Physics". LOL

Oddly enough, I always loved the "Locrian" & "Dorian" scales/modes, (my left hand seems to love those patterns) hehe, but, I never really knew what those scales were called, until recently, when I started going back to my teacher last year. Still don't know what all the terminology means, but, whatever.

I know a couple of exotic "patterns", but, as much as I love them, and REALLY LOVE the way they sound, I hardly use them, basically, because I don't know enough about them, or know many of them. I guess the exotic patterns are out of my "comfort zone"??? So to speak....Someone like Marty Friedman can play the hell out of those exotic scales...But, not me! LOL

Luckily, because I have a great ear for note placement, I can basically (within my playing capability) just play whatever notes fit a particular tune, or mood.

I basically shoot a solo from the hip. It usually works. LOL

Chris

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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 10:24 AM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Brother Chris, no worries on knowing what you are playing. I may have studied theory and have a vast understanding but when it comes down to just playing, I don't think - oh I will play this scale here and that arpeggio there, yada, yada, yada. A lot of understanding theory and concepts really just help you to connect, grow and possibly expand new ideas. You gotta use the theory in order to make it work, then make the work usable in your playing style. If I was to analyze what I play, yes I can but when I am playing or improvising, I am in the moment and mostly hear what I play.

If you take the theoritical concepts and apply the ideas, you can develop new passages and growth. You still have to apply them and make them musical.

My best example is from the Pink Floyd song "Time". For the longest time I wanted to learn David's solo in that song. One of my technique is active listening. No matter how much I tried, I couldn't hear what he was playing so I finally pulled the mistress out and played her with the song. I found that it was just a simple D major arpeggio he was playing all the time. Granted I can hear scale variations, extended chords identify them and such but I couldn't hear a simple D major arp.

The bottom line - Frank Zappa best said it - "Shut Up and Play Your Guitar". So that's what I do.

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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 2:31 PM

Chris Pinto (24466) wrote:

Yo Bro,

I literally find music theory as complicated as quantum physics.

Chris

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Re: Scales pt II

11/17/2009 3:46 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Baby steps bro, baby steps. Take it simple, take it slow. It is better to learn, know and tried then never to have been exposed to it at all. Theory is to music as grammar is to the english language, it needs to be proper but the rules can be broken!

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Re: Scales pt II

11/19/2009 10:59 AM

Chris Pinto (24466) wrote:

"it needs to be proper but the rules can be broken!"

Kinda like "Ebonics" LOL

Chris

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Re: Scales pt II

11/19/2009 1:58 PM

Randy Hano (12149) wrote:

Bruddah for me it is "Pideon". The Hawaiian form of Ebonics li' dat!!!LMAO